Stakes, Spoils, and Post-Match Punishment

So if you can talk about it, what happened with your girlfriend? Are you able to suppress your emotions about it around her now? Does she know something happened? It’d be hard to imagine she wouldn’t pick up on a change in you, especially considering how perceptive women are.

She knows all

I am a straight man and I love to fight for very degrading and humiliating stakes, even disgusting. No fighting for top though.
When 2 men challenge each other and fight to see who is the alpha male, if stakes and humiliations are agreed and the limits respected, it is fair that the loser assume his inferiority.
I have already lost and been really very hardly humiliated. And yes, I have already truly felt humiliated and degraded, spent very hard times and had my ego really hurt. I had to do things that really disgusted and traumatized me, but I can’t regret because it if the game. My opponents were stronger than me.
I have even did fights with money at stake, and sometimes huge amounts. I have lost mostly of them and have faced very serious financial issues, but the winner deserved to take my money. No regret. A stronger man is superior and the loser must assume the consequences, especially when he was very confident and cocky. I can only thank men who showed no mercy and humbled me the hardest way.

What did you do that was humiliating and degrading to you if you didn’t fight for top?

This sounds fun. I cant afford the financial stakes but very open to other humiliations. Writing or posting a review written by the winner detailing the loss is a fun one

I'm obviously a little late to this forum and hopefully this post doesn't aggravate any past traumas by bringing it up again. Fightingforfun, thank you for sharing and I hope that burden has subsided enough that it no longer effects your life and relationship anymore.

Part of the reason why I wanted to post was because I've had a few experiences like this, both on the giving and receiving end. Often my stakes don't involve winner tops loser stakes, but I always prefer high stakes that can often lead to trauma and a couple times they have been fuck stakes.

I think fuck stakes or any form of high intensity stakes that can lead to trauma should be discussed in depth prior to any match. Often times many men go into a match with high stakes fueled by a fantasy. When reality sets in that some fantasies are a lot harder to handle than imagined it can be jarring and traumatic. It's really on the fighter that has more experience with the stakes being discussed to be forthright about what it may lead to. On the face value it may be agreed that "winner tops loser" and attention is then given to making sure you're both clean, the multifaceted aspects of "clean".

There is still one major aspect involved though. What are the intentions of both fighters if they win? What do they want to get out of fucking the loser? Let's face it, winner deserves what is owed them and the loser deserves what they have agreed to and now has to handle those stakes. Backing out of stakes is a cardinal sin up there with ghosting someone last minute prior to a match. The two fighters may not be clear on the intensity and intention of those fuck stakes. The more experienced one may have the full intention of fucking the loser as hard and rough as they want knowing it's their first time being fucked and they are a sadist who gets off on causing trauma. Meanwhile the other fighter may even shit-talk and play into the fantasy and claim he plans to fuck his opponent rougher than he ever has been before, but in reality he'd be more conscientious to the loser's needs and may be "rough" but will ease up if he gets asked to. I think this aspect is the most critical and this goes with any high stakes. What is the intensity and intention of the stakes to each other wrestlers?

Not to get too pedantic, but because we get wrapped up in fantasy, shit-talking, machismo, etc. we forget to address that important question of discovering what the intensity and intention is. Not to mention that often times there is a disconnect even on verbiage, like one's "brutal" or "intense" may be far different than another's so you almost have to use examples of the condition they want to leave the loser.

I've gone on long enough, please forgive the wall of text, but I hope someone gets something out of it. As a sadist and someone who risks, high stakes I want to always make sure that my opponent understands my intentions and I understand theirs. Stay safe out there everyone, but also good hunting.

Thanks for your detailed and thought-through response: I think it's extremely important. To me, the last thing we should be doing is retraumatising ourselves. Visiting the trauma safely (safe words agreed and included if need be) for defusing or healing purposes is not the same: if you have to retraumatise yourself, that implies to me that you're not emotionally or psychologically fit to enter such a match, especially if you aren't doing it with someone safe. I like to wrestle for fuck stakes with me topping, but I would never insist on it if the man genuinely found at the appropriate time that he'd actually made a mistake (let's remember that as males it's one of our drives to test ourselves and take risks; if we're not thugs or psychopaths, we should acknowledge that men can make mistakes while acting in all sincerity, and be supportive of their taking the real risk of admitting that). If the victor insists on pursuing a fuck stake with an unwilling or unsure opponent, that's pure and simple rape. No wonder it's associated with regret. Properly speaking, it should be associated with a jail sentence.

Great, detailed comment. Thanks!

It was after what was supposed to be a submission match with another married guy that I opened up to wrestling for top. I had never topped or been topped. During the match he got my gear down and tried to top me. He never penetrated and I was able to struggle out of it. My mindset was this guy was trying to rape me so I am gonna rape him. I got him down and and gave him what he tried to give me. That is the first time I topped a guy. After that I accepted some wrestling for top challenges and made sure they were against guys I was pretty sure I could whip. The first one instructed me on the cleaning out before the match. I won the first two matches for this stake before I got the humiliating experience of getting owned and used. Unlike fightingforfuns experience, he started out easy understanding it was my first time. It started out very uncomfortable and I was conflicted. I didn't like it but was turned on by the dominance. An unexpected consequence was I started getting an intense feeling that I was about to orgasm and actually did hands free. I didn't know at the time but he was massaging the prostate. I walked away from the experience very conflicted. I was humiliated at becoming essentially a guys bitch. I almost didn't want to wrestle anymore but I was turned on by the dominance. I also had a problem that it started out painful, maybe pressure is a better description,and was an intense pleasurable experience. I didn't want to even think of it as a good experience but it was and that bothered me. The experience got me to get back to working out for a while so that the next stakes match would have a different out come. I have had 16 matches for top now and have won nine. Losing a match and getting topped is probably the greatest humiliation but I strive to get better after the experience.

Well, part of stakes matches is that there is a chance you will lose and get used. If you don’t want to be someone’s prize, don’t get in stakes matches.

Short and sweet. I couldn't have said it any better.

I agree to that!

Fighting for stakes means that losing will have serious consequences with the purpose to make you fight hard and realizet that giving up will be no option!
Fight to win and pay for the agreed consequences if you lose without comments!

Doesn't matter If it was his strategy to hide his real strength until the last round or not. He then was even more the stronger guy.
From his point of view he just took his prize.
If it was agreed before it was okay, I think.
I wonder If you would feel better now If the fucking would have been more gentle.

Is it possible that you were setup? Maybe he carried you until near the end when he took control with one punch. Maybe he wasn't such a nice guy, and his true attitude came out when he was on top???

I suppose I can’t rule this out. A lot of what I landed felt like he was letting me get the shots in. During the last round, which we only got about a minute into, he was in complete control. As I got tired, it seemed like he got fresher. His punches all through the last minute hurt way more than anything in earlier rounds.

I found Fighting for Fun's post to be enlightening. I consider myself mostly straight but growing progressively more bi curious as I get older. I've often wondered about the "ultimate" stakes match. Obviously there is a component of it that I find appealing, at least in concept, however I too wondered if the reality would be a rude awakening. I'm guessing that Fighting for Fun's story is much closer to that reality.

It would be interesting to hear from others who do not classify themselves as gay yet wonder about taking this last big step.

Glad you took the time to express how you feel. Actually as a gay dude coming out in my situation, it was like my first time I got fucked. After it happened, I thought about it for a long time the same way you are but eventually it went away and for me, became pretty more erotic in my mind and whether I top or bottom, the connection with another dude from that night became beyond crazy. and made me horny and jacking off every time I thought about what had happened. I think now, when I do a stakes match, I know my ass or mouth may be on the line and my balls get a lot bigger than they already are when another Man starts talking smack with me. I think I let my dick do the talking to some degree. Don't know if that's what happened in your situation or that you just got caught up in the moment. I've let my dick do the talking before in situations and thought while it was happening, what the f'k was I thinking but in the end....I took it like a man, stood by my word and learned from it. I'll continue to do stakes matches and I know I'll still get caught up in the smack talk when it's someone I know I may not have a chance against but am so turned on and excited to challenge Him. Don't give up boxing if that's what you enjoy, just sit back and say, ok is this going to mess with me if I end up agreeing to the stakes he is wanting and lose. Until you are gloved up and in the room facing the opponent, you have time to think again and hopefully if you back out, he will understand you hesitation and why.

Cody that is so hot. We have to fight for it.

I write this now roughly a week after it happened, and still, I don't feel like I've had remotely enough time to process everything.

Last week, I was fucked after losing a match for the first time.

It seems as though there are countless keyboard warriors out there who love the online trash-talking aspect of stakes, but never really get out there and do it. I know there are some real people out there as well who participate, both tops and bottoms and everything in between. As for me - I had never included fucking in any sort of stakes before, but I had always been curious. Did loser sucks winner twice. Won one and lost one. Both were a big rush for very different reasons. I thought I was ready to try the ultimate in stakes. What I realized it that you're never REALLY ready for it.

The guy I met was in Illinois. We boxed in my hotel room. The fight itself was a lot of fun until the very end. We were evenly matched, and it was a great workout. I'd like to think that if there had been points, I'd have been slightly ahead, but he caught me with a surprise punch across the jaw that I never saw coming and that was that. KO.

We had agreed to everything before the match. It would be a blowjob to completion (with protection), and then the loser would get fucked (once again, with protection and plenty of lube). It would have been my first time regardless of winning or losing. He'd won a couple in the past.

The blowjob was a little rough, and there was some trash-talk, but nothing out of the ordinary, at least in my limited experience. But once he put the tip of his cock against my asshole, it became a whole other thing.

I got fucked just about every imaginable way. There was just something about being beaten and then penetrated and used that seemed 100x worse than having to suck a cock. It was just like being used. Or even like being beaten up more. He was as rough as he was verbal the whole time, as though fucking someone turned him into a completely different person. We were cool before the fight. Even during, he talked a little smack, but it was all friendly competition. But the minute he started fucking me, it felt like everything changed. I was just a bitch to him. Or more accurately, his bitch.

Maybe it is for some guys, but for me, it was nothing like the fantasy. It felt degrading. It felt humiliating. It made me realize that sex can be as punishing a weapon as it can be pleasurable.

I think about it now and immediately get a knot in my stomach. I don't know if it's nerves? My girlfriend knows I'm into boxing, but didn't know about this fight. Now, when she brings up anything involving the gloves (we play around with them every once in a while), I immediately get choked up and want to cry. All I can see when I close my eyes is the flash of his boxing gloves clubbing me across the face, all so he could eventually bend me over and fuck me.

When we cleaned up and took off after the match, I was just in a stupor. I honestly don't remember anything we said to each other. It all just felt surreal. A week later, and I feel like he took everything from me in that hotel room. I've purposely kept busy at work to avoid having time to dwell on it. If being knocked out took a piece out of my ego, but fucked shattered the whole thing. Another man brutally fucked me. Even typing the sentence seems unreal. I think about it and feel fear. The simple idea of thinking of my opponent now and realizing that I'm genuinely afraid of another boxer's cock just isn't something my brain can process.

I guess at the end, I'm not really sure what the big moral of the story is. For some people, a fantasy is even better when it comes to life. For others, the fantasy becomes a nightmare.

Thank you to anyone who takes the time to read this. Just the act of typing it out feels like a massive weight off my shoulders. Be safe out there.

Thks for sharing. It's a good reminder to us all to know ourselves and clearly state our desires and intentions.

I'm so sorry this happened to you and I wish you all the best and healing moving forward. I may catch some flack for this which is sad but oh well. Stakes or not you always have a right to say no and revoke consent. Even though you didn't specifically come out and say "no I change my mind" I can't imagine that your body language said "i'm loving this" He should have been paying attention and been checking on you. This is not on you in the slightest. When you are with a partner whether a hook-up or not, partners need to check in on each other. Usually the top should check on his bottom but not a hard set rule. If you ever want to talk or just vent just shoot me or someone you can trust a message, you don't have to go through this alone.

I'm not going to give you flak perse, but I wanted to provide a bit of additional perspective.

Majority of what you said I agree with and mostly because of a key phrase "when you're with a partner" one should check in on each other. You're right in that regard, but realistically anyone going into the situation he agreed to should not have the expectation that the winner will treat them like a "partner" by taking into account the loser's emotional state or wellbeing.

I mentioned in a previous post that that's why I believe understanding of intent and limits be expressly discussed. Even if you believe on moral grounds, societal grounds, or the grounds of common decency the winner/top should stop if asked, that's not always going to be the result or even ever the intention of the winner, especially when it comes to stakes.

Whenever stakes are involved both fighters should be very clear on their intended outcome if they win or lose. If that means fucking the loser and continuing to fuck them after the loser begs them to stop is stated as a desired outcome then that should be taken seriously. And if that's not the outcome you're willing to risk, then you should not agree to stakes like that.

It's definitely unfortunate what happened to Fightingforfun, but it happened in large part due to misinterpretation, or to put it bluntly naivety. I don't think he should be blamed for that or even that it makes what happened to him okay. I believe it was on his opponent to be upfront with his intentions though. For all we know maybe he even was upfront with his intent to not stop even if begged to. Sometimes warnings like that can be interpreted as "shit talk" or bluster.

I've been very thankful that all my past opponents on MF have treated myself and the situations we put ourselves in with respect. But I also know that the reason why many of us are on here is because we are looking for not just sport, but an aggressive outlet, sexual outlet or combination of the two. We should be wary of the situations and opponents we deal with especially because their are so many variables. I've often regretted the outcome of a match because the stakes I had to endure were severe and traumatizing, but I knew going into the match that would be the case if I lost. It's definitely not for everyone, but one should always be honest and upfront with their opponent and even themselves before stakes are finalized.

That’s fair but going off of what was stated in his original post which is all we have he was raped. He was not informed of how aggressive and brutal his “opponent” would be. There can not be consent if it is not informed consent. Just because it’s a “stake” doesn’t mean someone’s bodily autonomy goes out the window.

@OHJobber99 you’ve hit the nail on the head. In the legal sense we all retain our right to change our minds once consent to sex is given. Analogize it to a dating situation - one can say yes and then say no at any later time. Maybe it’s not “sporting” but there you have it. And it’s not like a money bet that could be enforceable because it does involve bodily autonomy. The only way no can mean yes is if they both agree and understand that I really want you to continue even if I beg you to stop, and there’s a safe word. I have been in those situations as the winner and it’s gone both ways.

It's been long enough where I feel like I can comment on this thread again. I really appreciate the input you all have given.

Beforehand, we agreed to a safeword that would immediately stop all action, whether it was fighting or sex.

During the boxing portion, I took so many shots to the head and face, that once I went down for the count, my head was just swimming. I was in a haze from the punches, and when you combine that with the adrenaline of the fight, plus the fear of what was coming next, it really took away all of what would have been my normal mental function.

While he fucked me, I was desperately searching for the safeword. It felt like it was just... out of reach? I couldn't remember it, and so I begged him to stop. Since there was no safeword, I assume he thought of that as me playing along, so he fucked me harder.

I think I disassociated a little bit during the experience, like I was just a shell of a person watching from the outside. Every 5-6 minutes, he'd put me into a different position, and each time he pulled out, I thought it might be over. Feeling his cock penetrate me again and again for the first time in a new position was what made me crack, and eventually realize that begging wasn't going to do anything, so I just took it.

I'm so sorry again that he did this to you. It really is awful and you were in a state of altered mental status which he should have realized means you couldn't have consented to the stake. Even if it was given prior he should have had better judgment and not been a shitty person. I hope you are getting better even just a little bit at a time. Things like this never go away and I hope you have found some great people to lean on and help you through everything

I am sorry that your experience was so bad. Thanks for sharing it here anyway.
Since everything was agreed before and happened in a safe way I could ask: What was the problem? In a stakes match the loser has to suffer. But I do understand what you mean. I only had a few stakes matches. The punishment after always was like a second match. Very humiliating for the loser. Luckily I didn´t lose often - and was not yet fucked.